wtfplay project - it's official

[frd1996]

I uploaded new images: 0.7.2

This is a patch release that fixes a bug where NVMe disks were not mounted automatically.

If you do not use NVMe drives then there is no reason to update.

F

[tony]

Working away with it here Fryderck. Sounding great. I have changed out the amp so got improvement with that anyway but I will be very interested to see what the lads think about it when they do comparisons with the new preferred option of SD player.

[rickmcinnis]

Been away a long time preoccupied with learning how to use DSP.

In the interim I destroyed the SDTrans again with power supply trials. What a dumbass.

I had been using my measuring computer with WTF just as a back up and was surprised at how good WTF had become. Many of my previously held "beliefs" have lost their believability or maybe I am learning that convenience with a small cost is good compromise. Being able to see one's files easily is so much better than the cryptic little screen on SDTrans.

Of course, i admire those of you playing with those other SD players but I have decided to forego those kinds of things and stick to construction projects with loudspeakers.

A long way of saying I have recommitted myself to WTF.

I had attempted to tell what i have found at DIYAudio and have given up because of the strange ones who are not even using the player want to make comments about things they know nothing about nor want to know anything about. More of those ABX obsessed folks who inevitably have systems where no one could tell the difference in anything. I cannot imagine reading threads about something I have no interest in using. Oh, well. One wonders if they ever really listen. They seem to be on the forums an awful lot. Backgrounders I assume. If it makes them happy fine.

I knew one of the fellows was a complete fraud when he suggested that one use a SATA drive to boot WTF since it would boot so much faster. Sure, you know about the player.

I guess what sparked this inanity was the fact I had reported that with this cheap little motherboard which contains an INTEL J3355 - the two core one if I got the number wrong. I am using the J3355M and had used before the J3355B. The M is larger but other than that the only difference i can see is that the M uses "desktop" memory and the B uses "laptop" memory.

I am using the HDPLEX 200 watts ATX module and I made a SALAS L Adapter to power that. I built to supply 19 volts at 5 amps. A large (not huge) heatsink since i anticipated some real heat but the thing stays lukewarm and a bit about that when the sun is shining into the room. Not much power is needed here.

I know I have been one to say all kinds of stupid things about USB and I thank Nigel for attempting to show me the error of my thoughts.

I first started off with SATA for the music storage and it was obvious this board had something good about it. At this point I am using the HDPLEX SMPS.

That desire to just see what happens got me to use an SD USB adapter and play my old SDTRans disks. This was better Not earth shattering by any means. The the insatiable desire to turn things off in the BIOS hits me to the obvious. With SATA turned off in the BIOS using USB for music storage and to the DAC it was a change anyone could hear.

The on to externally powering USB using adapter for the headers on the motherboard. STARTECH makes one that is easy to switch where the power comes from Of course, I mean you have to use a soldering iron and some wire.

This was another step forward. I know I am not telling anyone anything the majority of folks here already know and have known - I am just telling what I did.

I should throw in it was never my intention to have anything like what I had before. The aim was to find that compromise between good performance and be as small as I can have it.

Used the old AUDIOWIND regulators that we used for the battery chargers for the USB drives Did not make a difference I could ever identify. I stuck with it since I want to lighten the load on the in progress SALAS regulator.

What is interesting about the move to the SALAS was that it booted just like it ever had which was a relief. This is with SATA off. I found if I turned SATA back on with the L Adapter it would not boot. Since i had no intention of ever using SATA again this was not a problem. Other than the fact I had to connect a regular ATX supply to get to the BIOS screen so I could turn it off again.

Early on I did substitute the well regarded EVGS (I think that is what it is named) 800 watts supply and it was reassuring to hear how immediately and genuinely AWFUL it was. Even the ABXers could have heard that.

In addition to giving up SD transports I have given up on trying to DSIY a DAC. I got one of the balanced SOEKRIS and destroyed it and that was enough. I got the Matrix Audio X-Sabre Pro mqn - I am getting embarrassed as I type that ridiculous name - since the guy at, of all places, AUDIO SCIENCE REVIEW found ti to be the quietest he had tested. I had no interest in looking around forever so that is what i got.

With additional embarrassment I have to admit there was about six months where I used the measuring computer which used a FOCURITE SCARLETT 2i2 for the interface for ROOM EQ WIZARD. Using the earlier version of WTF in a machine most assuredly not optimized for audio. I was using 16 feet of AMAZON balanced cable that cost sixteen dollars. Plenty good enough for test tones!

I was very surprised that this could be enjoyed. No one would rhapsodize on it but it could be enjoyed for a couple of hours with ease.

Needless to say it was a great jump in quality going from this to the current setup - teh MATREIX sounds really good to me. I guess i am lucky I know no one in my area so i am not exposed to the other DACs. I rest assured knowing there are better but think this thing was a very good value and the case is first class. Not in looks but the fact it is milled out of aluminum plate. Which makes me laugh when I think of my own efforts spread out on sheets of plywood. The thrill for that has passed me by.

One interesting thing about this DAC is that it allows you to choose between asynchronous and synchronous input. I had read that this was mainly intended for folks with CD transports. I found it sounded better with the synchronous input with the small ASROCK boards. From this i assume they possess a better than average USB implementation.

I have found that the core2 version sounds best with this CPU. There is some kind of conflict with the i7 version which loses phase above 2 kHz. You get this "spaciousness" but at the same time it sounds, to me, like someone changed the phase in that region. I figure this is due to the CPU and would not be universal but I do think folks should try it. You never know ...

I think the board with the desktop memory sounds better with the benefit of being cheaper.

So if anyone is looking for a fairly inexpensive and not labor intensive though some labor would be required I think this motherboard has much to offer and it responds well to the tried and true stuff we have done for years. One cannot dismiss the ease of selecting what you want to hear with WTF and the tuning of frames and periods can make a worthwhile difference. Just think of the hours one can spend trying out different frames and periods ... I find myself staying with 512 and 2 with 50% priority

So far, I do not hear any difference between my SD cards and a fancy SAMSUNG USB stick - the one in the aluminum case and a MUSKIN 256gb that is supposed to be MLC - I have not tried those exotic SD or USB drives since I cannot for the life of me see how it would improve things since the file is sent to the memory at one time, at least that is what I think happens.

IS there an issue with the files getting corrupted over time? Is that the reason for using an SLC? But for that to be practical you would be writing so often to the stick that corruption over time could not happen if it can ever happen. Just trying to figure out what the advantage would be unless it is the simple - it just sounds better. At this point i do not know.

Also wondering if anyone has used a setup where the AVX instructions are used? Again, I cannot see an advantage with that - especially since from what i have read, which isn't much all of the CPUs that support it require lots of power.

[frd1996]

Rick,

To answer your question about AVX.

This is another generation of SIMD (Single Instruction Multiple Data) extensions in the modern x86_64 CPUs. The basic idea is to allow the CPU to perform the same operation of multiple data in parallel fashion rather than sequentially. This allows the program to be executed more efficiently (read: faster).

How can this be used? Simply speaking, programs need to be built (compiled) with the support for the AVX instruction. In other words, the compiler generates AVX instructions when translating program source into binary executable code. This in turn allows for faster execution of that code by the CPU.

What happens when one attempts to run such AVX optimized code on a CPU that does not support AVX? Simple - the program crashes as soon as the CPU detects such unknown/illegal (for that CPU) instruction.

When would using AVX be desired? Typically, anywhere when you need to decode data or convert data, e.g. decoding FLAC audio file, but it is not limited to this. The code compilers are pretty good in detecting certain patterns in the code that can be optimized with AVX instructions and they use the appropriate optimizations.

In the scope of wtfplay, does using AVX optimized image sound better? I do not know. The program code will be executed more efficiently by the CPU, but it does not mean that the music will sound better. More precisely, it does not mean that it will sound better to you, in your setup. This is something that you have to find out yourself.

I hope that you will find it helpful.

F

[jrling]

Working away with it here Fryderck. Sounding great. I have changed out the amp so got improvement with that anyway but I will be very interested to see what the lads think about it when they do comparisons with the new preferred option of SD player.

Hi Tony

Wondered if that had been any feedback from the guys doing a comparison between Wtfplay and the Group SD Player? Obv comparing Apples with Pears, but still would be of interest.

In the meantime, I have been experimenting with settings on Wtfplay 0.7.1/2 to great effect. The particular setting is PRIO (Linux process priority) of Wtfplayer. A setting that can be adjusted in Wtfsetup easily. Or adjusting -p on the command line - see Wtfplay Manual Section 4.2.

Having read the manual now (!), Fryderyk did make clear that setting the PRIO to a higher value, could have negative SQ effects. Ignorant intuition would suggest the opposite. Anyhow up, in Linux the PRIO setting of 50 is a critical one, affecting how Linux handles the various processes.

Cutting to the chase, a PRIO value of <50 does give a noticeable SQ improvement on my setup (see signature).YMMV of course.
I have tried from 35 - 49. All sound better than the default of 65. 49 is the most dynamic and 35 the most relaxed, with both being excellent. So one can effectively tune your playback flavour to taste. I have settled finally on 38. That's what comes of having much time on one's hands in lock down.

Hope others might like to try this to correlate whether SQ improvement is heard.

[tony]

Hi Jonathon,

Fryderck had contacted me about the priority about a month ago and he suggested to try the range you have posted. I tried but just did the two extremes and found 35 to be my preferred just like yourself albeit you tweaked a bit more. He gave me no prompting but we emailed briefly after I tried it and he I think prefers 35 also. Interesting that 3 of us independently have come to the same conclusion. I should experiment a bit more but with the new higher watt Jadis amp and WTF I have just enjoyed how well all sounds (Detail and clarity and ability to clearly hear all instruments is astounding) Think this release has really been a nice big leap. I also disable the onboard soundcard. What I have found so far listening to SD and WTF is difficult to tell a difference. Have found myself by and large ignoring the SD player so maybe subconsciously I have tested it thoroughly :)

With this covid thing hifi meet ups are currently a thing of the past sadly. Nobody else I think has bothered to compare it. Ideally I would like to get Pearse's dac back up here as his implementation of the groupbuydac is by a big margin the best but he has absconded to the far side of the country! For years he was about 20-25mins away so visits and swaps were easy.

[jrling]

Thanks Tony.

Good to hear that all three of us have reached the same conclusion on the PRIO setting. On my set-up the improvement on 35 was material compared with the default of 65 for 0.7.1. Ditto with disabling the internal sound card. It is definitely the best quality I have heard on my system.

If we are getting close to SD Player SQ, that's very good news.

[jrling]

Tony - in for a penny, in for a pound/euro, last night I tried listening tests on -p <35, fully expecting SQ to tail off.

But No. The opposite was the case and it got better the lower the -p figure was. Not night & day better than -p 35, but noticeable in the way you described - (Detail and clarity and ability to clearly hear all instruments is astounding)

I ended up keeping -p 5.

Would welcome you referencing these findings and anyone else using Wtfplay who is inclined to try.

Jonathan

[tony]

Good I see Fryderck has sent another test version yesterday! Sorry did you settle on 35 or go down as far as 5?

[frd1996]

Try 5.

F